Tagged With "Downvote"

Topic

Ad Revenue and Content Item Score

MichelleG ·
So, this is a post where I'm trying to get clear in my head the relationship between ad revenue and what the narrative organization, content creators, owners and moderators etc. will actually get paid. The owners and moderators payout is parasitic on the content creators' so we can just look at that. I'm new to all this so if somebody could correct any egregious errors, please please do so. In advance , the TL;DR for this post is as follows: How the reputation system works is going to...
Question

Downvote comments by known trolls as AUP violations?

Malkazoid ·
A question for the community. @MOLLY O suggested we downvote their content and comments as low quality if they are trolling posts. I'm wondering if AUP violation is a possibility too? After all, the troll is violating the AUP (or should be seen as such) by using a dummy account to cause disruptions and malign the network. Thoughts?
Question

My reputation went down. How do I tell why?

Bashar Abdullah ·
So after some discussion yesterday about Reputations feeling like on Pause and not going up, ironically I noticed mine went down few points today. Now the goal of reputation is to push for better content and engagement. How do I tell what caused the dip overall? Was it Too many posts Not enough engagement/votes for posts Downvotes on posts Downvoted comments? Too many comments with no upvotes? I'm worried about last point. If a comment with no response is considered bad, I often reply on...
Conversation

When Down vote someone , Please reply a comment for justification.

MALAY BANERJEE ·
Sometimes I see someone downvoting me but don't know why I am downvoted by someone. So I want to raise a question for discussion in the community today when someone downvoting somebody, he /she should mention the reason for downvoting in the comments section. Downvoting is needed but for a valid reason is ok but if somebody downvotes others without any valid reason is not good. Please reply in the comment section for discussion. Thanks for everyone .
Suggestion

new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Gosia Rokicka ·
Is it possible to add an option to downvote for the reason "posted in an unsuitable niche" (as per this post by @Christina Gleason)? I think it's a legitimate reason to downvote but we shouldn't be forced to choose "low quality" because these posts are often of good quality... Just placed in the wrong place. Which, as Christina already suggested in her article, seems like an attempt to game the system by potentially providing rewards to certain niche owners. At the moment, if the...
Suggestion

Please remove or change the downvote

Nrve ·
It is causing a lot of problems and pushing content creators away: https://www.narrative.org/post/one-of-the-biggest-problems-with-narrative-the-downvote-we-need-to-remove-it-or-change-it
Suggestion

Justifying downvotes

Szabo ·
In my opinion giving a reason to a downvote could solve a lots of issues such as decreasing or making visible at least the unfair or abusiv downvote and increasing the quality of posts as the authors know what to do differently in the future. This could be done by forcing the downvoters to select a reason for downvoting from a dropdown list or writing an other reason. How do you see this suggestion?
Suggestion

Alternative voting system

Vico Biscotti ·
Downvoting seems to be taken badly by too many people here. AND cheap content seems to be excessively rewarded. AND voting circles are there. Gradual upvotes - combined with a fixed "power" of each member and pattern detection - could solve much of this. Imagine giving a user a certain number of "points" per month. These points are proportional to reputation (amplifying high reps, and disempowering low reps). So, let's say that, with my rep, I have 100 points per month. Now, let's say that...
Suggestion

Optional Upvote or Downvote Transparency

hgn66 ·
I would like to suggest an option on voting for posts. With this option you can decide on any post that you want your vote stay hidden or visible. By doing this, while you can keep your votes secret, you are able to notify your friends too. Sometimes there is no time for us to leave a comment on post but we want the author to know we saw their post. So by this mean anyone can choose between being anonymous or open to public. The options can be: 1. Totally Anonymous 2. Just Let The Author...
Suggestion

Stop abusive downvoting: announce future measures now

Malkazoid ·
Problem Right now, the only tool we have against abusive downvoting, is the higher weight given to high rep voters. We are observing this is not sufficient against abusive downvoting circles, who seem to carry enough weight to cause real, malicious damage. If you require explicit examples, I can provide them privately. The influence of rep on voting weights is not linear at all, but seems to be quite exponential. While this could be pushed further and further, we also could run into the...
Question

YES or NO question: Will Narrative ever penalize downvoting circles?

Christina Gleason ·
Everyone knows that at least one large downvoting circle exists that includes at least one high-reputation member, if not more than one. Those of us who are often the targets of mass downvotes know it. Other people who comment on our posts are beginning to feel it, too, because COMMENTS on our posts, or comments we make on other people's posts, are getting downvoted, and it cannot be easily argued that these are low quality. Heck, even people who aren't often targets of the downvoters have...
Conversation

Downvoting Abuse

hgn66 ·
So I just keep it short because someone asked. And I know it's been issued before. I just sent my last article; https://www.narrative.org/post/there-will-be-blood And it received immediate downvotes in less than 3 mins! and it's just 7 people. I think there is an abuse going on the platform. And somehow some automation, like a bot. If you want to know more and track those 7 downvote you can check this post, which my post refered to it; https://www.narrative.org/post...ehold-the-screenshot...
Suggestion

Lets add the downvote reason field to Low Quality voting, too

Malkazoid ·
This may feel like a familiar suggestion: previously this field was requested in a suggestion, for AUP violations. Almost immediately in the comments of that older suggestion, people chimed in that this reason field would be very helpful for Low Quality downvotes also. The Team has since implemented the field for AUP downvotes only. In order for the Low Quality downvote reason field to remain in the ticket queue, this ticket is probably necessary explicitly for that functionality. There has...
Reply

Re: My reputation went down. How do I tell why?

Ted ·
We cannot tell you why your score changed, since we are not monitoring your account. I can tell you that you will not be penalized for the number of posts you make, so you should never have to worry about doing too much. My guess is that your quality score went down a little bit, perhaps because of some downvote action, but unless it was a major drop, I personally wouldn't worry about it too much. We will be continuing to monitor our reputation code over time, of course, to ensure that...
Reply

Re: My reputation went down. How do I tell why?

Bashar Abdullah ·
Thanks @Ted . At least I know about posts now
Reply

Re: My reputation went down. How do I tell why?

Ted ·
Yeah, sorry I can't be more helpful. I wish my own reputation was going up faster, too.
Reply

Re: My reputation went down. How do I tell why?

Bashar Abdullah ·
@Ted We all do
Reply

Re: Downvote comments by known trolls as AUP violations?

Vico Biscotti ·
@Malkazoid , I was wondering the same. I sometimes report with low quality, sometimes as a violation even if they're not exactly a violation, but SHOULD clearly be, since cheating by multiaccounts is commonly considered negative conduct (not always easy to detect them with certainty, but AUP does not even mention explicitly).
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Re: Downvote comments by known trolls as AUP violations?

Slaz ·
I downvoted them as Low Quality, but did choose AUP violation for a few comments when they were insults or personal attacks.
Reply

Re: Downvote comments by known trolls as AUP violations?

David Dreezer ·
I think it's a bad idea to blanket report anything you deem as a troll to the Tribunal as an AUP violation. As an absolute minimum it simply adds that much more load to what will be the Tribunal. Mark it as low quality, and then just do not engage. Don't feel the troll's ego and rep by adding comments and replies. Stop rewarding the Trolls, just downvote for low quality, let it submerge, and move on.
Reply

Re: Downvote comments by known trolls as AUP violations?

Vico Biscotti ·
Let's remember that those are not just trolls. It's an individual, acting with a scheme, that is polluting conversations and approvals/bids of niches. Also, new users don't know about this and WILL give him attention.
Reply

Re: Downvote comments by known trolls as AUP violations?

Colleen Ryer ·
@Vico Biscotti makes a good point, people are unwittingly engaging -they don't know that some of the comments, posts, bids, etc are coming from troll accounts. New users are at a disadvantage unless the word gets to them. And after reading the AUP, even if the comments don't violate it, one person using multiple accounts to appear as several is impersonation - one reason to ban, at least.
Reply

Re: When Down vote someone , Please reply a comment for justification.

Colleen Ryer ·
It would be nice if people explained why they downvote, but some won't. It may be because they think the reason for the downvote should be obvious - and sometimes it may be - if the terms of service or AUP have been ignored. I think that having to select a reason helps to keep unfair downvoting from happening very often, but on occasion, it still does. And I do see that some comment if they have an issue with a post, and skip voting altogether - which in my opinion is far better than just...
Reply

Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Vico Biscotti ·
We really need that...
Reply

Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Colleen Ryer ·
Maybe, @Gosia Rokicka there's not a selection for this because moderators are supposed to remove mis-posted stuff? But for niches with no moderators in future it might be needed if owners aren't doing it.
Reply

Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Gosia Rokicka ·
Indeed, but what guarantees that future mods will be moderating properly? Some niche owners don't do it - they can be elected as moderators or the same people who are now posting to "wrong" niches on purpose can apply to be mods and get voted in... At the end, who is paying attention? About 15 folks who are active on this forum...
Reply

Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Colleen Ryer ·
The community votes mods in, and can vote them out if they aren't following the rules. My take on it is, that when mod elections come, any owner who wants to moderate their own niche, has to be voted in, with the same rules applying. The current situation with owners "winging it" is just until we're ready for moderator elections, which I hope is really soon.
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Gosia Rokicka ·
Yeah, but can't you see the "winging it" people can still be voted in? If they have decent reps and they won't have much competition in the elections they probably will be... Because not many people are paying attention to this slightly unsavoury behaviour...
Reply

Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Colleen Ryer ·
One moderators are elected, then a new Tribunal will also be elected that includes members of the community. While it's up to the community to take action when rules are broken, it only takes one member, if a moderator/ or owner/moderator, won't co-operate, to post a complaint to the Tribunal, who is obligated to take appropriate action. I read in the spec, too, that once the new Tribunal is elected, a committee made up half community members and half HQ team members will also be elected to...
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Vico Biscotti ·
@Colleen Ryer , I fear the "unsuitable niche" issue is going to stay for long, also when moderators will be elected. I posted in a niche (because it was relevant) where the owner logged in 5 months ago, and maybe the niche won't even have moderators. It's certainly an unmoderated niche and it's going to stay as it is. From what I see it's not the only niche. Not only; I fear that most members just don't care about moderation in niches, so, moderator elections can just be a political thing.
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Colleen Ryer ·
I agree an extra downvote option might be useful into the future, even if just because of "absentee niche owners" who haven't selected any moderators. I avoid absentee niches, but not everyone will - by the same token, tho, if members don't care about how suitable an absentee niche is for the content, they won't use the downvote function, either. Also since moderating is paid, members might eventually take a dim view of sloppy moderation - why waste community funds that could be going to...
Reply

Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Garden Gnome Publications ·
I think "inappropriate niche tag" should be a reason to downvote. Then, the owner and moderators of the niche should be notified of that downvote for that reason. If they remove the post from their niche, then the downvoters should each get a notification to be allowed to change their votes.
Reply

Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Colleen Ryer ·
Maybe the "inappropriate niche tag" vote could lead to an automatic notification to owners and moderators, rather thn who ever is downvoting having to do it?
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

David Dreezer ·
Continue on, but I think there needs to be a reminder to the discussion that there is only ever one version of the content, one set of votes, one set of comments. There is not a different version of the content for each niche, a different set of comments per niche, a different set of votes per niche. Whether the content is viewed in the Dog niche, the Cat niche, or the Ming Dynasty Vase niche it is the same content, thus a vote for "Wrong Niche" would be somewhat odd in certain...
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Vico Biscotti ·
@David Dreezer , I now see you're right on this. Downvoting would require the specification of the niche, which is overcomplicating. Still, I'm not optimistic about future moderation, but that's another story.
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

David Dreezer ·
I can help with that some, too. Moderators are voted in by the community. Moderators can be removed by the community if they are not doing the job. https://spec.narrative.org/doc...erators-from-a-niche
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Gosia Rokicka ·
That is a very good point, @David Dreezer , haven't thought about that. You're right. Hopefully, you're also right that moderation and a more mature community will smooth the issues. Maybe. Or maybe not. The wisdom of the crowd gave us Brexit and Donald Trump and it happened in apparently conscious and mature democracies. Luckily, when things go south, at least it's easier to leave an online space than a country
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Vico Biscotti ·
I know. Still I'm worried. Not many people seem to care about moderation, even if I fear this can damage the platform, so maybe elections are going to be more a political thing than something in the merit. Maybe I'm worried without reason. I hope so. Let's see. Question, even if it's maybe too early for this: I see a niche follower can initiate a petition to remove a moderator, but what if a niche isn't moderated and I don't know which moderator is responsible for that?
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

David Dreezer ·
The owner will moderate until an elected moderator is placed.
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Garden Gnome Publications ·
Thanks for weighing in @David Dreezer . This is a reminder that democracy is a long and inefficient process. If everything is left to the community, we'll have to resign ourselves to knowing that certain processes will take a while to work themselves out. For instance, how long should we give moderators before we realize they aren't moderating effectively? One month? six months? There is a process built into the platform, so we have to remember that Narrative hasn't rolled it all out yet.
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Christina Gleason ·
I like every point in this conversation, but I like this solution the most!
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Colleen Ryer ·
If it could be done without interfering with other tags that are appropriate, I do too, but it sounds difficult, unfortunately.
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Garden Gnome Publications ·
@Colleen Ryer , I don't think it would be too difficult, but I'm not a coder. Each post is tagged to up to three niches. If each niche owner, and, after moderators have been elected, the moderators, of a tagged niche received a notification that a post was downvoted for the purpose of being in the wrong niche , and with the further proviso to "check the content to see if it matches your niche and remove, if appropriate," that puts the onus on the moderators. They don't have to remove the...
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Christina Gleason ·
Or there could even be check boxes for the person choosing that downvote reason to select the irrelevant niches, so only those owners/mods would get the message.
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

BloggerKrunal ·
I would like to add one important thing here. If any one is selecting 3 Niches for a single post and if each Niche has minimum 2 Moderators than total 6 moderators will review that post and they all will have their own different opinions which might not beneficial with 100% in the favor of that Author nor the other 2 Niche Owners. In the end rarely such post will get rewarded with 100% upvotes as there will be always such conflicts lying on all posts. How we are planning to deal with that?
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

David Dreezer ·
I'm not fully sure that I understand what scenario that you are describing, but to be clear - Moderators determine whether or not a piece of content belongs in a Niche or not. They do not evaluate content submitted to a Niche in terms of quality. That is not the moderator's job. https://spec.narrative.org/doc...ion-niche-moderation
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

BloggerKrunal ·
I'm talking about moderators' upvotes and down votes on content. Ad you said, moderators can't evaluate the quality of the content, does it means they can't opt for voting on that content? If they can, then their votes might get biased based on their choice of Niches they represent.
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

David Dreezer ·
And? This is where I cannot find the point that you are making? Yes, Moderators can vote on content. Just as you or I can. And anyone else not Conduct Negative. Please, what is your objection? Are you perhaps confusing CONTENT voting with the Moderators amplified weighting on COMMENTS?
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

Colleen Ryer ·
I think moderators votes on content have the same weight as everyone else. So wouldn't be any more biased in evaluating content. I'm pretty sure moderator's votes on comments have more weight - and this is so they can quickly bury nasty comments, because they aren't allowed to delete stuff. And if moderators abuse this extra voting weight, they can be voted out, so it's not in their best interest to downvote according to their own preferences.
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Re: new downvote reason: "posted in an unsuitable niche"

BloggerKrunal ·
Yes, that's what I am talking about. Moderators' content voting should weight as equal like others. Their influence on comment bury is fine.
 
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